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 a new view on socialisim

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freecommunist
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PostSubject: a new view on socialisim   Sat Aug 09, 2008 8:58 pm

hello comrades,
I am Murdo Ross and i have seen the collapse of the USSR and i have seen communist china rise to be a world power after the great leaps forward after mao's death (god rest is soul) and i have seen the way china has adopted a new form of socailisim (please excuse my spelling i havn't had the best education) and many people call their policies not socailist after reintroducing private industry. Well without that in the soviet union the workers had to work long hours with very low pay and caused alot of unrest and poor econimy over the years. China have also reintroduced the world trade system into their nation which is a good thing as they can exploit the wests need for surtain things and get what they need in return. The USSR never used this and what happend collapse. Civilions couldnt buy jeans as the USSR didnt have the right materials to produce them i know a countrie without jeans big deal but its just proving my point in someways.

Any way to my view which is heavly related to the paragraph up their^^^
i belive that in order for communisim to work to its full we need to make some acceptions and take advantage of what the whole world has and use a little bit of evrything in our policies. such as my policies for my small but growing communist party of scotland the C.U.S.R (Communist Union Of The Scottish Republic) are that you need to improvise with all political points and use the best forms. The main views of us are, Band privateised healthcare, invest in education public transport and new housing in scotland, give free electricity to the people (as scotland has a massive amout of energy and with its indapendence from britain in the next decade we will have alot of electricity to use on a small nation) and with the rest of our energy we will trade for things that our countrie doesnt have (taking advantage of the world trade), Welcome all working imagrents to our nation so we can promote a multi-culterd nation, clamp down on religious bigotory, reintroduce capital punishment (ONLY TO USE IF THE CRIME IS REALLY BAD), drop our military spending as we only need an army to defend our nation.
this is only a few policies please leave me a comment on what you think
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bolshevik
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PostSubject: Re: a new view on socialisim   Sat Aug 09, 2008 9:12 pm

you know what i think, YOU SHOULD READ SOME FUCKING MARX!

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freecommunist
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PostSubject: Re: a new view on socialisim   Sat Aug 09, 2008 9:22 pm

well that was a bit strong 'GO READ SOME FCUKING MARX' i have read it and what happend when lennin took on his ideas it went corrupt i do not belive you youre self really knows what communisim is about being fair to the people and i would have my workers been paid minimal wage just because the government want the money to spend on military use. i will say however if i was to ban private industry i would use the money kept from it to invest in better education in scotland has we are neglegted by england and they take all our money away and are using it on their stupid olympic games (for 2012) when people are dying cause they have no healthcare. more than half of all scotlands public hospitals have been closed down so they can fund private healthcare and i don't think that is right my auntie has died because of this and i understand the fact you don't like NEW ideas and you just like to shut the worker up (me) tell me do you have a job?
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PostSubject: Re: a new view on socialisim   Sat Aug 09, 2008 9:33 pm

I dont mean to burst your bubble or anything but you are not a communist. You arent even socialist at best. What you described is capitalism where you are just making seem ok for everyone to live in the exploitable conditions of the bourgeoisie state. Yes the USSR and PRC are workers state but they have a way long way to go before we see anything significant. I would advise you to stay on the site and try and learn some because if there is anything us communist hate is a capitalist going around saying he is communist. There will be no communism until the entire world is communist until that there is still the need for a state which that in itself is oppressive and anti-communist. Sit down and read the manifesto once, its only like 40 pages. you will soon see that what you have stated is reactionary and in the long run still oppressive. Just stick around and ask any questions you want.
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solpacvoicis
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PostSubject: Re: a new view on socialisim   Sat Aug 09, 2008 9:39 pm

....market socialism LOL

sorry, socialism does not equal the market, and...because scottland is from what i know, a modern country, socialist leaders don't have to do the whole capitalist deal

or something like that.

so, what are your views on syndacalism, direct democracy, communes, and how do you propose to move on to communism?
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bolshevik
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PostSubject: Re: a new view on socialisim   Sat Aug 09, 2008 9:40 pm

freecommunist wrote:
well that was a bit strong 'GO READ SOME FCUKING MARX' i have read it and what happend when lennin took on his ideas it went corrupt i do not belive you youre self really knows what communisim is about being fair to the people and i would have my workers been paid minimal wage just because the government want the money to spend on military use. i will say however if i was to ban private industry i would use the money kept from it to invest in better education in scotland has we are neglegted by england and they take all our money away and are using it on their stupid olympic games (for 2012) when people are dying cause they have no healthcare. more than half of all scotlands public hospitals have been closed down so they can fund private healthcare and i don't think that is right my auntie has died because of this and i understand the fact you don't like NEW ideas and you just like to shut the worker up (me) tell me do you have a job?
have you read capital?
and first of all im not a leninist, as a mattter of fact im mod of the left communists(De Leonist).
i dont even know where to begin.
yes i do have a job, im a camp counsler at a camp for special needs childern.
my brother died because of lack of medical attention from the US health care system.
also it was brought to my attention, that you, an obscene idealist, posted this disgusting article in the idealism section.
how fitting.
btw
thanks for the LuLz

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Shabazz Freeman
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PostSubject: Re: a new view on socialisim   Sat Aug 09, 2008 9:51 pm

wow...I am so joining this brawl when I get back home...
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Stos
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PostSubject: Re: a new view on socialisim   Sun Aug 10, 2008 5:39 am

freecommunist wrote:
hello comrades,
I am Murdo Ross and i have seen the collapse of the USSR and i have seen communist china rise to be a world power after the great leaps forward after mao's death (god rest is soul) and i have seen the way china has adopted a new form of socailisim (please excuse my spelling i havn't had the best education) and many people call their policies not socailist after reintroducing private industry.
Calling China communist has a tendency to make me stop taking the rest of the stuff that you say seriously. Don't do it.
Anyways, what China has adopted now is, quite simply, not socialist. If you want to debate this, you can, but it's not really the point of your post, so I won't elaborate.

Quote :
Well without that in the soviet union the workers had to work long hours with very low pay and caused alot of unrest and poor econimy over the years.
Because what did the Soviet government spend most of their money on? Oh yeah... The military. And saying that the Soviet Union's form of 'socialism' didn't work well doesn't at all mean that all forms of socialism are invalid (since, from what I can see, you're not advocating socialism at all).

Quote :
China have also reintroduced the world trade system into their nation which is a good thing as they can exploit the wests need for surtain things and get what they need in return.
You seem to believe that giving the Western nations what they need in exchange for what you need is somehow exploiting them. It's not.
This is generally irrelevant to actual socialism, though.

Quote :
The USSR never used this and what happend collapse. Civilions couldnt buy jeans as the USSR didnt have the right materials to produce them i know a countrie without jeans big deal but its just proving my point in someways.
...Prove your point some other way? It's still irrelevant, but please explain why you believe that the collapse of the USSR was due to not entering international trade, rather than overspending on the military, etc?

Quote :
Any way to my view which is heavly related to the paragraph up their^^^
i belive that in order for communisim to work to its full we need to make some acceptions and take advantage of what the whole world has and use a little bit of evrything in our policies.
...So how exactly would you convert to communism from socialism, then?

Quote :
such as my policies for my small but growing communist party of scotland the C.U.S.R (Communist Union Of The Scottish Republic) are that you need to improvise with all political points and use the best forms. The main views of us are, Band privateised healthcare, invest in education public transport and new housing in scotland, give free electricity to the people (as scotland has a massive amout of energy and with its indapendence from britain in the next decade we will have alot of electricity to use on a small nation) and with the rest of our energy we will trade for things that our countrie doesnt have (taking advantage of the world trade), Welcome all working imagrents to our nation so we can promote a multi-culterd nation, clamp down on religious bigotory, reintroduce capital punishment (ONLY TO USE IF THE CRIME IS REALLY BAD), drop our military spending as we only need an army to defend our nation.
this is only a few policies please leave me a comment on what you think
I think that you're not a socialist. And don't see why this party is better than, say, the SSP.

freecommunist wrote:
well that was a bit strong 'GO READ SOME FCUKING MARX' i have read it and what happend when lennin took on his ideas it went corrupt
Which invalidates, say, De Leonism, and makes the market the only way forward?

Quote :
i do not belive you youre self really knows what communisim is about being fair to the people
It is. Also, GO READ SOME FUCKING MARX.

Quote :
and i would have my workers been paid minimal wage just because the government want the money to spend on military use.
You would, wouldn't you? And seriously... What?

Quote :
i will say however if i was to ban private industry i would use the money kept from it to invest in better education in scotland has we are neglegted by england and they take all our money away and are using it on their stupid olympic games (for 2012) when people are dying cause they have no healthcare. more than half of all scotlands public hospitals have been closed down so they can fund private healthcare and i don't think that is right my auntie has died because of this and i understand the fact you don't like NEW ideas and you just like to shut the worker up (me) tell me do you have a job?
Our job is to plait the priest's entrails, for want of rope, to strangle kings.


Last edited by Stos on Sun Aug 10, 2008 6:06 am; edited 4 times in total
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SicSemperTryannis
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PostSubject: Re: a new view on socialisim   Sun Aug 10, 2008 5:43 am

Support for private industry and the death penalty?

Marx would shit his pants.
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freecommunist
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PostSubject: Re: a new view on socialisim   Sun Aug 10, 2008 6:41 am

sory that is a typo i woulndt have my workers paid minimaul wage.

you people are stuck in the past of communisim witrh no new ideas you need to stop reading ideas that faild and improve on them.
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freecommunist
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PostSubject: Re: a new view on socialisim   Sun Aug 10, 2008 6:43 am

and the SSP isnt realy a socialist nation just like the labour party when they fist came into power after WW2 they claimed to be coacial and the people wanted a socail nation and they changed after a few years.
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Stos
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PostSubject: Re: a new view on socialisim   Sun Aug 10, 2008 7:30 am

Either way, how is the SSP worse than your party would be?
Anyways, explain how De Leonism failed. Or Trotskyism.


Edit: Y'know, I'm starting to get slightly suspicious here.
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PostSubject: Re: a new view on socialisim   Sun Aug 10, 2008 9:21 am

freecommunist wrote:
sory that is a typo i woulndt have my workers paid minimaul wage.

you people are stuck in the past of communisim witrh no new ideas you need to stop reading ideas that faild and improve on them.
We are not stuck in the past its just that we are orthodox communist. And im sure anyone here is up for new options when they arise but from wat we can see non have. The thing we have a problem with is what your saying is not communism in the most prehistoric sense. Your organization doesnt fallow the basic principles of communism so how can we except your form of communism when it is still capitalist? Even though there are different forms of communism we have a united enemy which is capitalist so why would we want to convert to being capitalist?
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solpacvoicis
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PostSubject: Re: a new view on socialisim   Sun Aug 10, 2008 10:37 am

freecommunist wrote:
sory that is a typo i woulndt have my workers paid minimaul wage.

you people are stuck in the past of communisim witrh no new ideas you need to stop reading ideas that faild and improve on them.

....IDEAS THAT HAVE NEVER BEEN TRIED rzdoihgtjsierugweuyfbrnjf

there hasn't been a successful socialist revolution in a MODERN country. see that word? MODERN.

THAT'S what your party should be concerned about.

just. listen.

CHINA and RUSSIA - when their revolutions occured - NOT MODERN.

then russia's whole small industy that might've allowed them to just move along socialist lines was destroyed in the civil war...

they both had one thing in common - a socialist-minded government trying to accomplish capitalist tasks rapidly so as to move on to socialism.

THE UK IS MODERN. ALL PARTS OF IT. NO NEED FOR YOU TO DO CAPITALIST THINGS. GAAAAAAAHHHHHHHHHHH!!!!!!!!

sorry. having to prove to anyone that communism is possible is a frustrating thing. having to explain past events that i don't particularly see as relevant to today's world in terms of specific tactics to accomplish a revolution because they insist they have failed is even more frustrating.
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bolshevik
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PostSubject: Re: a new view on socialisim   Wed Aug 13, 2008 3:17 pm

dude freecommunist,
YOU HAVE FAILED!

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mattabesta
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PostSubject: Re: a new view on socialisim   Thu Aug 14, 2008 4:06 pm

freecommunist wrote:
communist china rise to be a world power after the great leaps forward after mao's death (god rest is soul)

wtf dude
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