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calinis
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PostSubject: universal healthcare   Sun Jul 13, 2008 7:53 pm

i heard that we are going to have private healthcare in canada which is good because now people wont die from long waiting lists and we wont have to pay additional taxes. in the US they have all the medical testing done the day they comem to the doctors so they know what is wrong with them instead of having to wait.
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solpacvoicis
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PostSubject: Re: universal healthcare   Sun Jul 13, 2008 9:10 pm

no, in the u.s. people die from not being able to afford their healthcare =D good luck paying hundreds of thousands of dollars!

also, by opening up more centers, wouldn't that eliminate the line problem...?
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PostSubject: Re: universal healthcare   Sun Jul 13, 2008 9:15 pm

didnt you say you were poor? good luck going to the doctor and getting medicine
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calinis
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PostSubject: Re: universal healthcare   Sun Jul 13, 2008 9:18 pm

no because there are only certain amount of specialized i live in a small city so i wouldnt be able to get surgery here i would have to go to vancouver or something i'd rather pay for my own healthcare than wait while some other person has access to i before me and its not hundreds of thousands of dollars. if that was the case, how do americans afford it?
i'm poor rte now but im going to get a phd and be really rich
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PostSubject: Re: universal healthcare   Sun Jul 13, 2008 9:20 pm

how are you going to pay for it? you realize that surgeries usually cost 20,000+ for something simple.
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solpacvoicis
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PostSubject: Re: universal healthcare   Sun Jul 13, 2008 9:25 pm

good luck paying for college LOL

and yeah. most americans can't.
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Tyrongkojy
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PostSubject: Re: universal healthcare   Mon Jul 14, 2008 11:52 pm

"I'm going to get a PHD and be really rich!" If this goes through, bad shit will happen. First off, it's your RIGHT, not a privelege, to have healthcare. To be given the help to liive, that's a right. Are the wait times long? Yes. Because EVERYONE is getting HELP. You really don't want to help other people? Come on, PLEASE, think about that. How selfish is that? It's EXACTLY like a chiarity, our healthcare system. Also, if that goes through, man, Canada will officially suck fucking balls.. I msotly like it now. It has issues, but... Oy.... I fucking hate the current government.
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calinis
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PostSubject: Re: universal healthcare   Tue Jul 15, 2008 1:13 am

no i dont want to pay for scum to have acess to healthcare and have a crappy quality of healthcare americans healthcare is so much better because since you're paying for it you get more advantages like in canada they dont tell you whats wrong with you so you could have cancer and not even know it and the tests arent conducted that day and the results given to you that day you have to wait
so yeah if you want to have surgery because other people who dont deserve have it have it first how is that fair????
by people who dont deserve it i mean drug addicts and people who cause their own problems
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Tyrongkojy
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PostSubject: Re: universal healthcare   Tue Jul 15, 2008 1:44 am

First, it's called a period. USE IT! Second, it's charity to help those that can't help themselves. I mean, I've never met someone so selfish. It shames me to live in the same country as you. Your kind is who brought us down from the number one place to live IN THE WORLD.
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calinis
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PostSubject: Re: universal healthcare   Wed Jul 16, 2008 1:50 am

charity? some on man, i'm not paying for people who caused their own problems to have heathcare. how the hell does this make me selfish? i say work hard and get the healthcare you deserve. if someone wants to screw up their life by taking drugs i'm not paying for them to fix their problems that were caused by their stupid drug addiction (which is their fault entirely) canada was never the top country to live in btw. yeah long waiting lists are what everyone wants nevermind that you might have an aggressive form of cancer and need immediate treatment.
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Tyrongkojy
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PostSubject: Re: universal healthcare   Wed Jul 16, 2008 9:52 am

LOTS of people who DON'T take drugs will STILL not be able to afford healthcare and get treatment for their agressive cancer. As a living human being it's your right to have healthcare. Living, and sic. As long as someone has those, they shouldn't just be told to go DIE. And they will, oh, they will. ONE health issue and, like in America, your life savings will go bye bye. A second? Dark ages medical treatment, here I come! Warning: side effects may incude death.

As it is, you DO have to be working, and thus contributing. Or under your parents. And yes we were number one. In the 90s. 93-96, if I recall correctly, I think I'm off, but we were there.. Now we're 20ish. We're actually below America, something that shames me to no end. No offence, Americans on here.
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solpacvoicis
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PostSubject: Re: universal healthcare   Wed Jul 16, 2008 11:04 am

believe me, i take no offense o.o;; i want out of this terrible place before some strange disease gets me lol
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calinis
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PostSubject: Re: universal healthcare   Wed Jul 16, 2008 11:51 am

dude if they have to be in long waiting lists then the person with cancer will die. how is that right? shouldnt healthcare be an individual responsibility? you know, since you're paying for it, you get the best treatment. if you screw up life you shouldnt get healthcare. that would deter those scum and maybe they would actually try to better themselves instead of relying on gov. support, actually do something.
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Tyrongkojy
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PostSubject: Re: universal healthcare   Wed Jul 16, 2008 1:19 pm

But not EVERYONE who can't afford is is a DRUGGY who screwed up their life, like you think! Layoffs, business going under, or just MAJOR HEALTH ISSUES! It has NOTHING to do with drugs! Get off the drug wagon, there's more to life than drugs!

No, I'm sorry. It's obvious you've had some bad issues with people in your own life taking drugs, so I can see where you're comming for in blaming it all on drugs.

But you have to understand there are other reasons too why some people won't be able to afford it. I say why not help my neighbour, if he can not help hiimself. It's how civilised, kind, loving societies are made. Otherwise no one cares about each other, and where does that lead?
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Steel
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PostSubject: Re: universal healthcare   Thu Jul 17, 2008 1:44 pm

calinis wrote:
in the US they have all the medical testing done the day they comem to the doctors so they know what is wrong with them instead of having to wait.

This is what my parents do in the NHS.
The problem with their job is not that they are public sector employees but they have shit loads of unnecessary paperwork to deal with and....

...thats right you guessed it, they have to deal with private companies who make them pay through the nose for their equipment and supplies.

do you think that public sector health workers sit around for a day and then do the work or something?
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Zealot_Kommunizma
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PostSubject: Re: universal healthcare   Fri Jul 18, 2008 7:01 pm

This guy is definitely a troll... but well... lets reply to him...

Last summer I stayed two months in USA and while riding bike I was hit by a truck. My foot was swollen and got somewhat twisted, it had some cuts and I could definitely not walk with my two feet. The impact against the road caused me some scratches that were deep enough to bleed. It was not a really serious accident, could have been inmensely worse.

Well, the police approached to me and said that they would not give me a 150 USD fine because being a foreigner I didn't know US transit laws. And after laughing a bit at the funny incident and asking me wether I could walk back to home (40 minutes walking) or I needed an ambulance. After one of the policemen saw my foot he called the ambulance.

So the ambulance comes and starts my first (and hopefully last) experience with US healthcare service. Having several bleeding wounds I expected the guys at the ambulance to give me some antiseptics, all they did was put an icebag on my foot and took me inside the ambulance. They checked my blood-pressure and heart beating rate, you know standard procedures. And in 10 minutes we were in the hospital.

I was taken first to a room, then to another room. Then doctors came asking me to get naked and put my belongings on a bag. They started checking again bloodpressure, heart beating rate and such things... they finished and I asked them "Would you please give me some antiseptics?" They said "Later". While checking me they were talking to each other like if I was not there "Man, I had this party but thanks to this I'm gonna be late..." the other doctor replies "Terrible". They go out. Then come other doctors to take the X-Ray. And then one guy comes and tries to give me an antithetanic shot to which I refused, he said "If you don't take this you'll die within 24 hours" (WTF?) and immediately applied the shot.

1 hour and a half later another doctor comes and tells me "Hey, you didn't break any bone". And then came a nurse put some fiberglass structure over my leg (I don't remember the term for those things) after bandaging it. I had been asking to anyone to give some antiseptics or at least some damned soap to wash my wounds for all that while, that I would do it myself, tat I just needed the damned soap and some water. Just after 1 hour and a half I was applied by the nurse some sort of antiseptic jelly in some of the wounds.

I call the person I was reting a room to and my gf they came and we went out.

Two weeks later I receive a letter with a receipt: 1,700 USD for that medical procedure. 1,700 USD... 640 USD for using the ER, 440 USD for the X-Ray, 40 dollars for an antithetanic shot, 125 USD to pay the doctor and I don't remember what else...

My gf and I were staying in a house with other Russian girls (my gf is Russian), when I told them they couldn't believe that. I was astonished too. 1700 USD for something that would cost a maximum of 200USD in the most expensive Mexican private hospital and which would be free in any SS hospital? For something that nearly elsewhere in the world would be for free? For such a service in which I had to beg for antiseptics? Fuck that! I'm still in debt with that hospital! And some US friends there told me it was one of the cheapest hospitals in US, that it was non-lucrative... For a non-US citizen that is a terrible healthcare service.

Curious thing I saw a couple of weeks later that Michael Moore documentary on healthcare and insurance service in USA... it made a lot more sense after that accident Razz

Summary: US healthcare service is extremely expensive and proportionally bad. Private healthcare is non-workable.

Here there is a Spanish hospital in which a person was being charged 400,000 USD for an open heart surgery. They were poor people and had gone in emergency to that hospital, since they couldn't pay that ridiculous sum, they were kicked out of the hospital, the patient died some hours later.
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KOMMUNISMUS
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PostSubject: Re: universal healthcare   Tue Jul 22, 2008 3:24 pm

yeah ..... no ... just no

you have the best system possible my family went to the hospital in america to get one test done (my aunt) she was lucky enough to have health care insurance we waited for 20 hours just to get a room and tests still nothing happend after that it
it takes too long and she still had to pay so its better when its free at least
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Tyrongkojy
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PostSubject: Re: universal healthcare   Wed Jul 23, 2008 1:31 pm

Wait times are bad. But I'd rather GET it later than NEVER.
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mattabesta
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PostSubject: Re: universal healthcare   Wed Jul 23, 2008 4:59 pm

privet health care? who got that idear? what dumbfuck ever thought of such a crappy system?????? ok I I'll make a list of heath care I've gotten free of charge ofcourse.

dental correctiony thingy: 400,000 ISK
broken my left arm 2 times: 150,000
Gazillion times I've had to go to the dctor for all kinds of stuff: 100,000

that's like what 650,000 isk??? wich is eqal to 6500 dollars and I havn't had ANYTHING serius imagen If you got cancer!! or heart desise wich 30% pepole get this before they turn 70!!!
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Rename
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PostSubject: Re: universal healthcare   Mon Jul 28, 2008 7:56 pm

Tyrongkojy wrote:
It's your RIGHT, not a privelege, to have healthcare. To be given the help to live, that's a right.

You don't need much more than this.
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mattabesta
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PostSubject: Re: universal healthcare   Tue Jul 29, 2008 7:58 am

Rename wrote:
Tyrongkojy wrote:
It's your RIGHT, not a privelege, to have healthcare. To be given the help to live, that's a right.

You don't need much more than this.

no house insurence is unnessasary
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Tyrongkojy
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PostSubject: Re: universal healthcare   Wed Jul 30, 2008 9:44 pm

And car. Really, the only insurance that SHOULD be free is health. The rest.... Meh.
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mattabesta
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PostSubject: Re: universal healthcare   Thu Jul 31, 2008 7:56 am

yeah but if you do own a house paying insurance pays off
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Tyrongkojy
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PostSubject: Re: universal healthcare   Thu Jul 31, 2008 3:57 pm

ESPECIALLY if something actually happens. Imaginary God forbid.
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Shabazz Freeman
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PostSubject: Re: universal healthcare   Sat Aug 02, 2008 4:02 pm

Universal healthcare isn't synonymous with poor health care.

IF hospitals are worker run then they set the quality standards
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